GhostWhoVotes reports a federal Nielsen poll to be published in tomorrow’s Fairfax broadsheets will show the Coalition, unchanged on last month. More to follow.
UPDATE: GhostWhoVotes further relates the primary votes are Labor 35 per cent (up one point), Coalition 43 per cent (steady) and Greens 13 per cent (down one), and the poll also shows support for gay marriage at 57 per cent and opposition at 37 per cent.
UPDATE 2: The poll finds little change in the leaders’ personal ratings. Julia Gillard is stable on both approval (54 per cent) and disapproval (39 per cent), while Tony Abbott is up two on approval to 47 per cent and down two on disapproval to 48 per cent. Gillard’s lead as preferred prime minister is 53 per cent (steady) to 40 per cent (up a point). The Coalition leads as best party to handle interest rates (47 per cent to 33 per cent) and create greater competition between the banks (46 per cent to 32 per cent). Fifty-five per cent now believe the government should serve a full term, against 42 per cent who would like a new election as soon as possible.
UPDATE 3: Essential Research also has the Coalition leading 51-49, for the third week running. Julia Gillard’s approval rating is at 43 per cent, down two on a month ago, and her disapproval up one to 38 per cent, while Tony Abbott is up a point on approval to 40 per cent and down five on disapproval to 40 per cent. Gillard’s lead as preferred prime minister has narrowed from 49-33 to 45-34. There are also questions on viewing of sport on free-to-air and pay television, presumably apropos of the anti-siphoning issue – although opinions on this are not engaged directly.
sorry; the multiplier effect was Dee’s contribution to the debate.
Apologies, Dee. Consider yourself now properly acknowledged 🙂
Darren,
[The fact that the ALP is only 2 points behind in TPP is in spite of, not because of, this compliant Tory media. Imagine if there were a balanced media …]
Excellent points about the cumulative effect of the brief snatches of anti-Labor ‘news’ the voter hears during an election cycle. Drip, drip, drip eventually fills the bucket.
Now, if there was a balanced media, if the truth was told about the Coalition, and the punters HEARD it, day in day out in the way they currently get messaged about Labor, I suggest the Opposition, as a spin-driven, negative, lazy and policy-free waste of space, would be reduced to minor party status in one election.
Boerwar,
I suspect that after the NBN and the separation of Telstra Tone will be left holding the Boatphone alone. I suspect that over time the coalition are going to largely render themselves redundant and given that apart from being the Party of ‘No’ they don’t have much in the way of substantion policies.
At that point I can see that there will be an opposition spill.
Puff@522 – please take that to the duty Labor Senator for your area. Had kid working in Health for awhile before transfer – said it is difficult to know what is going on out in the community because a lot of it is kept away from them.
Lots of empire building and protecting going on it needs to be in the open. This is how the Oppn gets a foothold while the Govt. is being softsoaped by the people employed to help them get programs working.
[Space Kidette
Posted Monday, November 22, 2010 at 5:31 pm | Permalink
Dee,
I have just started the space kidette twitter account. My aim – to put the facts back on the table. Everytime someone in politics starts with the Bull I am to put the facts out there with all evidentiary links.]
[No Tweet results for space kidette.]
Cmon tweet something then 😉
SK
Alas! You did not read my post the other day outlining the numerous ‘positive’ policies that the Coalition has. One may disagree with these policies but, IMHO, they were designed to resonate, and resonate they did. They enabled the Coalition to get to within a skerrick of forming government in their own right. They are part of the reason the Coalition would win Government outright on current polling figures.
Again, IMHO, it is better to acknowledge all this and address the implications, than it is to ignore all this and get slaughtered for being out of touch.
Had a very similar experience this last week with visitors from the country staying
with us. Its why the likes of bg needs to be called out and challenged as much as
he does it himself.
Paul J,
Give me a break – I only set I only set it up yesterday. But any tips as to outright lies are welcome!
SK
Plus, while the Opposition has better polling figures than Labor, and while Abbott is within a bull’s roar of Gillard, there will be no spill.
[Paul_JPosted Monday, November 22, 2010 at 5:43 pm | PermalinkSpace Kidette
Posted Monday, November 22, 2010 at 5:31 pm | Permalink
Dee,
I have just started the space kidette twitter account. My aim – to put the facts back on the table. Everytime someone in politics starts with the Bull I am to put the facts out there with all evidentiary links.
No Tweet results for space kidette.
Cmon tweet something then
]
Even better post us your Twitter name – and add that as a URL with your posting name.
SpaceK
try looking at the #auspol feed, some real doozies there
🙁
Blue-Green said at 472;
[From a media perspective I would seek out users of this technology and make case studies of them. Pitch the stories to catalyst, business insiders, landline, etc etc. I would also find local businesses across the country who are keen on it and make them case studies for local papers.
I would get JG and all other Minister’s standing next to folk who need it and want it. ]
Funny you should say that.
I know of just such a proposal right now in a city where Phase 2 of NBN is to be rolled out in 2011. Two award winning export businesses have basically said if they can’t get NBN then they will have to relocate overseas.
I know of modeling being done right now as to how much the benefit of staying with extra jobs would be verses the cost of going with an overall net loss to the local economy.
And this is in a National held regional seat.
Barnaby now talking about delivering the NBN to areas that allready have fibre 😉
Now it’s about the cost, it really sounds like they are struggling for a coherent argument now.
[Now, if there was a balanced media, if the truth was told about the Coalition, and the punters HEARD it, day in day out in the way they currently get messaged about Labor, I suggest the Opposition, as a spin-driven, negative, lazy and policy-free waste of space, would be reduced to minor party status in one election.]
Yes, Cuppa, exactly.
And then imagine if the MSM and their ABC spewed out ALP talking points to the same extent that they do currently for the rag bag of Coalition parties that make up Tony Abbott’s Opposition…
Would they win even a seat?
Boerwar,
Sorry I missed your post (or I have alzheimers -probably closer to the truth!) but I was referring to the key policies RAbbott ran his election on.
Frank
Did I ever tell you I have Calabrese (ie from the Calabrese region) relations (by marriage)?
It just goes to show that you can choose your friends but not your relations!
SK,
b_g clearly suffers from the afflictions of actually being able to make an argument, often having something interesting to say, and has the unfortunate habit of not simply being a slave to any relevant party cheat sheet. I suspect that the “manual” that the apparatchiks use suggests in such situations its a good idea to simply be as rude and dismissive as possible. Saves them suffering brain fade, problems with cognitive dissonance, etc etc.
Puff @522
I am trying very hard to contain my anger at the attitude you describe – and logged in especially to give a little sympathy.
These attitudes are precisely why so many people fear being sent to a nursing home – so arrogant and unfeeling. Sleeping in your familiar bed – that is such a normal wish.
I have a half-dependent 91 year old mother with us, and rather fear the future as she would never ‘conform’, so there will be fights ahead.
:hugs:
Rod
name names pilgrim!
[John Howard survived as PM for 11 years because there was no recession – and there was no recession because China started booming and we became a Chinese mine shaft. End of story]
and did nothing, but the people did not recognise that every one just went about thier daily business as though nothing had to change you know the world is flat who cares as long as i got money in my pocket, and i think thats the majority the one that want things done are us silly voter who vote labor and green the other could not give a toss as long they pay their mortgage and have pool in the back yard
thats why and old fashioned depression may have done some people good,
unfortunately we would of all been caught in it , and of course i wouldn’t be saying that then would i but what is the answer to make the other half of aust realise we have to update, i think that half may be havent even left aust. i know people who live in Melbourne very very wealthy who have not been to Sydney they go to the gold coast every year no matter what, and guess what they vote lib.
but then howard did upset the majority work choices i see what i mean
the maj did even care we where sending our young boy off to the weapons of mass destruction that didnt excist i dont get it.
[when i read the comment i thought gosh i was wrong i thought blue / green was blue for the ocean green for the earth ( well some of it) but then i questioned my self and thought perhaps blue and green are lib colours]
Green liberalism is an accepted political philisophy
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Green_liberalism
There is even a political party in Switzerland which espouses Green liberal views.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Green_Liberal_Party_of_Switzerland
[lizziePosted Monday, November 22, 2010 at 5:49 pm | PermalinkPuff @522
I am trying very hard to contain my anger at the attitude you describe – and logged in especially to give a little sympathy.
These attitudes are precisely why so many people fear being sent to a nursing home – so arrogant and unfeeling. Sleeping in your familiar bed – that is such a normal wish.
I have a half-dependent 91 year old mother with us, and rather fear the future as she would never ‘conform’, so there will be fights ahead.
:hugs:
]
And the worst offenders are those with a religious background.
[567 Rod HagenPosted Monday, November 22, 2010 at 5:48 pm | PermalinkSK,
b_g clearly suffers from the afflictions of actually being able to make an argument, often having something interesting to say, and has the unfortunate habit of not simply being a slave to any relevant party cheat sheet. I suspect that the “manual” that the apparatchiks use suggests in such situations its a good idea to simply be as rude and dismissive as possible. Saves them suffering brain fade, problems with cognitive dissonance, etc etc.
]
But of course that doesn’t apply to those from a Green view of politics now doesn’t it ?? Lest one accuses them of being exactly like those they are attacking ?
In Canada liberals are labor , we where a very confused family when we visited our cousins who where liberal thank god we worked it out after a while
[b_g clearly suffers from the afflictions of actually being able to make an argument, often having something interesting to say, and has the unfortunate habit of not simply being a slave to any relevant party cheat sheet. I suspect that the “manual” that the apparatchiks use suggests in such situations its a good idea to simply be as rude and dismissive as possible. Saves them suffering brain fade, problems with cognitive dissonance, etc etc.]
Come on Rod.
No-one here has suggested b_g shut up or go away – a few people have just suspected that his/her “concern” for the Gillard Government is token, naive and perhaps insincere.
You are free to disagree.
And others are free to call b_g on his ‘free’ advice on media messaging for the Gillard Government.
Our Lady of Lalor is my saviour. That doesn’t mean she has to be b_g’s or yours – but if he’s offering free advice which is either a best silly, or worse aimed discrediting/undermining Our Lady then we’ll politely tell him/her where to shove such advice.
🙂
Rod, and anyone else on board
[b_g clearly suffers from the afflictions of actually being able to make an argument, often having something interesting to say, and has the unfortunate habit of not simply being a slave to any relevant party cheat sheet.]
I have had a few discussions with blue_green and can say with certainty that he enjoys friction, but is always logical and interesting. He also has some useful background knowledge on many subjects. I would hate him to dispapear.
Those of you criticising his take on the media don’t know the difference between ‘spin’ which distorts reality, and ‘spin’ which is just good PR.
i was thinking has Ru been here of late i hope he is well.
[ I suspect that over time the coalition are going to largely render themselves redundant and given that apart from being the Party of ‘No’ they don’t have much in the way of substantion policies.]
They’re working on this. Income tax cuts will probably feature very strongly in the policies they’ll take to the next election.
Perhaps elected judges, as well ? I think Tone could get a suprising level of popular support for this … There is a lot of community anger (reflected in the tabloid newspapers) about “bleeding heart” judges letting off criminals with “slaps on the wrist”.
[577 my sayPosted Monday, November 22, 2010 at 6:02 pm | Permalinki was thinking has Ru been here of late i hope he is well.
]
He’s fine – having a break from Poll Bludger and busy playin g computer games.
[Perhaps ele ected judges, as well ? I think Tone could get a suprising level of popular support for this … There is a lot of community anger (reflected in the tabloid newspapers) about “bleeding heart” judges letting off criminals with “slaps on the wrist”.]
may be not when they work out they would be like a political party,
i cannot immagine a couple of magistrates i know door knocking for votes
can any one here
[In Canada liberals are labor , we where a very confused family when we visited our cousins who where liberal thank god we worked it out after a while]
In the US liberals are the Democrats (or Greens), in the UK they’re the Liberal Democrats. Australia is the odd one out here with hardset conservatives calling themselves LIBERALS. I bet they wouldn’t be game to go up to their Republican allies in the US and declare themselves Liberals!
[my sayPosted Monday, November 22, 2010 at 6:06 pm | PermalinkPerhaps ele ected judges, as well ? I think Tone could get a suprising level of popular support for this … There is a lot of community anger (reflected in the tabloid newspapers) about “bleeding heart” judges letting off criminals with “slaps on the wrist”.
may be not when they work out they would be like a political party,
i cannot immagine a couple of magistrates i know door knocking for votes
can any one here
]
Look at the US as an example:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YL79O-h1VjM
[But of course that doesn’t apply to those from a Green view of politics now doesn’t it ?? Lest one accuses them of being exactly like those they are attacking ?]
See what I mean, SK?
My Say,
No he is a British veteran, not on a DVA Gold Card, (I do not understand that, they were all shot at by the same bullets, or in his case, bullets at this ship).
I will be taking this up with the Minister and my local member, when I have the energy. They do not like it that he has no dementia and is perfectly capable of telling them what he wants (to stay and and if he can, die in his home). They got annoyed and bureaucratic with us.
The worst part was he has four beloved dogs (tenterfield terriers, who had to be locked outside for the visit of course, oh&s) and when he asked the co-ordinator if she liked dogs, she said no, I don’t like dogs. Talk about blunt! She could have said, she preferred fish or hermit crabs or garden gnomes and allowed him to talk about the dogs and ease into the care plan, but no, subject closed. I suggested she listen to him talk about what he wanted, surely you have time for that. She looked at the clock and so, no not really.
So this is the market forces at work.
Thanks My Say. 🙂
I don’t know what all the angst is about blue_green. He is far more coherent and logical than his detractors.
And for the ALP supporters here, I cannot recall him making a comment attacking the ALP or the govt.
What he seems to do, and does quite effectively, is argue that the govt could do a much better job of putting it’s case. I happen to agree.
The statements that the ignores a hostile media are just plain bone headed stupidity as he frequently agrees with that. Where he parts company with the Franks and Dave’s is that he is proposing something constructive that can be done to counter that hostile media.
And before Frank or anyone else jumps down my throat, I have already established that I have been an ALP member since before Frank even made it into short pants. The state of the present media is nothing new and in some respects it is
better thannot as bad as it was in the past.blue_green is one of the better contributors to this site and I suggest a bit of serious reflection about his message rather than a reflexive attack dog response because he doesn’t parrot the same tired lines as others.
Good to see that the Government is consulting on a comprehensive package to enable farmers to join in the fight against AGW.
I just hope that any soil carbon stuff is backed by rigorous science.
re: b-g
Anyone who doesn’t want to read b-g, shouldn’t.
The rest of us should continue to have the opportunity to read b-g as the whim takes us.
[And then imagine if the MSM and their ABC spewed out ALP talking points to the same extent that they do currently for the rag bag of Coalition parties that make up Tony Abbott’s Opposition…]
That’s the other barrel of the gun isn’t it Darren. Labor cops it both barrels: the anti-Labor message PLUS the pro-Coalition spin. All day every day. Fair enough if that assault came from one or two outlets only. But this is from the combined forces of News Ltd, Their ABC, the talkback pig-eyes, and commercial TV. There really needs to be some balance here. Their ABC should be pulled into line. Unlike the others, they’re REQUIRED to be neutral.
ABC24,
Showing JG going Turnbull in HoR.
Does Tbull have shares in Melbourne IT? Or not?
If so, hopelessly conflicted; If not, Opposition had better hurry and make this public.
[Space KidettePosted Monday, November 22, 2010 at 6:16 pm | PermalinkABC24,
Showing JG going Turnbull in HoR
]
and then the stupid question – Why are the ALP going against Turnbull” ?
Well Derr – if they didn’t same mental pyfgmies would be bemoaning that the govt isn’t tough etc..
And some here wonder why we make the comments we do.
[Our Lady of Lalor is my saviour. That doesn’t mean she has to be b_g’s or yours – but if he’s offering free advice which is either a best silly, or worse aimed discrediting/undermining Our Lady then we’ll politely tell him/her where to shove such advice.]
It is, indeed, always difficult combining the conflicting desires of those who treat their particular party affiliations like religion and want to make sure the orthodoxy gets adhered to with those of people who actually want to discuss issues and tactics and trends and the like on political blog sites like this one, darren. William, I’m sure, has a job as tricky as Harry Jenkins.
[In Canada liberals are labor]
In practice, yes … but only because Labor has shifted so much to the right 🙂
The ideology of the Canadian Liberal Party is Liberalism while that of Labor is supposed to be social democracy. 🙂
The Canadian Liberal Party is affiliated with the Liberal International federation while Labor is affiliated with the Socialist international.
Frank @ 591
It is not simply a matter at ‘going against Turnbull’, it is a matter of making the attack as effective as possible to achieve maximum result.
An ill-directed rant will not do this.
RH
Nah. William, if sufficiently provoked, can just whack somebody into digital oblvion.
[What he seems to do, and does quite effectively, is argue that the govt could do a much better job of putting it’s case. I happen to agree.]
Ditto!
vik @ 593
Isn’t there a party similar to the ALP in Canada, the New Democrat Party, or similar?
bemused: with you 100% and echo your sentiments.
As much as a respect Frank as a True Believer, at times his own rhetoric – not to mention his annoying habit of insulting those who are merely arguing a shade of grey, rather than coming from an opposing point of view – is completely over the top.
There are people on here who seriously need to take the blinkers off and take a good, hard look at the party. A primary vote figure of anything less than 40% is NOT GOOD and should not be spun as such. We need to put all of our policies on the table and look at what does work – not only for the populace, but for us as a group of people who do (and should) actually believe in things – and what doesn’t.
What we should NEVER do, is just parrot the party line. Accusing people who don’t of “helping to elect Tony Abbott” or similar nonsense isn’t helping anyone, least of all the Labor Party as a whole.
And I say this as a party member of 20+ years (and a HTV card hander-outer for 8 years before that).
thanks Lizzie, looking after the over90s at home is a completely different ball-game that is not recognised in any of the programs, yet more and more people are living to over 90 yrs old and living at home. Their needs and their carers’ needs (which in my case is simply more care for the caree and easy to access respite) are neglected because, as demonstrated in my case, their care packages are not increased with their increased dependency because it is assumed they will go into a nursing home.
He told them I needed training in his care, they said I didn’t need training. But all their staff get OH&S’ed until they are next to useless in the home.
Anyway, that is enough of a rant from me. This is a phespos’l site after all.
hugs
(Good luck with your oldie. Tell her never to stop fighting.)
Boerwar@587
Exactly. And anyone who thinks he is is wrong & talking nonsense should
continue to call him on it even if people here like rod, bemused etc take
umbrage at this. Either we are all entitled to put our views or none are.
BTW – Can *anyone* point to where bg has be told to go or not post ?