Time for a new open thread post, though I don’t have a whole lot to hang one off. There’s always US pollster Morning Consult’s tracking poll on approval of Anthony Albanese, which continues to record no significant change since June, with Albanese currently on 60% approval and 27% disapproval. This gives him the third best result of 22 international leaders being followed by the pollster, behind India’s Nahendra Modi and Mexico’s Andrés Manuel López Obrador.
There are also two new sets of supplemental results from last week’s Resolve Strategic poll in the Age/Herald:
• A series of questions on outcomes from the Jobs Summit published on Saturday had favourable results for multi-employer bargaining, more TAFE places and allowing older Australians to earn more before losing the aged pension, but only 34% in favour of the increased migration intake, with 33% opposed. Only 24% rated themselves “definitely aware” of the recent Jobs Summit, compared with 38% for “vaguely aware” and 38% for unaware. Thirty-six per cent agreed it had achieved its (non-political) objectives compared with 19% who disagreed and 46% who were either undecided or neutral.
• The Age/Herald had a further result yesterday showing a 64-36 break in favour of a constitutionally enshrined Indigenous voice, evidently based on a forced response. Clear majorities were recorded in all states, and while there is no reason to be dubious about this, the Tasmanian sample especially would obviously have been exceedingly small.
Asha @ #123 Tuesday, September 27th, 2022 – 5:21 pm
I’m simply trying to make the point that these people, Trump and Hanson, are political opportunists looking for a headline and appealing to the worst instincts of their people, but who themselves obviously, with their friendships with people of colour, are not racist per se.
You can point to policies that Trump, especially, initiated in office, but then you go to look at his rallies and you see signs such as, ‘Latinos for Trump’ and ‘Blacks for Trump’. And you see the friendships he has had with Omarosa and Kanye West and African American preachers, and so can you honestly say that he is a racist?
I know it’s a more nuanced argument than many are willing to admit to but I just can’t see why others don’t see what they are doing, like Abbott and the Coalition did here, where they were against Muslims, until Muslims became a solid and influential voting bloc and now they can’t embrace them enough.
Same with Pauline Hanson. Her whole schtick has been to be Australia’s Bigot #1. But I don’t see her doing what an acknowledged racist, Jim Saleam, did when he firebombed Chinese restaurants. I haven’t seen her go to a citizenship ceremony, for example, and rant and rave at the people inside becoming Australian Citizens. And I’m damn sure she accepts all the votes of people who aren’t White in Australian society who want to shut the door after them and not let any more immigrants in.
Yes, she is a vile individual and a bigot and a political opportunist, but I don’t think her rhetoric has fallen to the level of believing these people are lesser individuals. As in, of lower IQ and are lesser beings, just because of the colour of their skin, as racists do. Which Dr Mehreen Faruqi most obviously is not less than Pauline Hanson in any way at all and who runs rings around Pauline Hanson.
There I hope that answers your question.
Rex Douglas @ #389 Tuesday, September 27th, 2022 – 8:39 am
It was a public session on the stage Rex – them two and A.N.Other. It’s on YouTube, I’ll be watching later 🙂
Ray (UK) @ #402 Tuesday, September 27th, 2022 – 5:44 pm
Ooh thanks for that. I shall search it out. 🙂
Is Bwana Bandt tacitly accepting that Elder Atkinson deserved everything she copped from Thorpe?
When will he show some leadership on this matter?
He was ready enough to take on Hawthorn in a foam-flecked spray of righteousness.
Perhaps the Greens have already initiated a secret internal disciplinary process of the sort that they don’t want to see for the FICACC?
What time is BW going to bed?
The idea that the UK Labour Party would be better off with first-past-the-post than a system like preferential voting or proportional representation is one of the more bizarre arguments I’ve heard. FPTP, and the tactical voting that inevitably results from such a system, is currently one of the biggest obstacles to Labour’s chances of winning majority government.
We all know that Bwana is concerned for the welfare of Indigenous First Nations. He tells us so all the time. That is why he reckons that they need to be led to the correct Way on the Voice which is a complete waste of money.
But surely this concern must start at home?
Only fringe lunatic parties which are doomed to eternal political irrelevance unless they get some form of BOPmail are truly attracted by proportional representation.
Their twin wet dreams?
Belgium which cannot form a government.
Italy which forms a government every three months.
Insane.
I suppose it has already been posted but it should be live broadcast on ABC.
https://robodebt.royalcommission.gov.au/
Thhopre is does the greens more damage tothem she helps then in saying that her chieff of staff leaking now is strange
Perhaps the Greens are looking for a sort of facebook announcement that Thorpe’s behaviour has been investigated and that it meets all the Greens’ high standards of individual rights, of respect for elders, people of various genders, Indigenous First Nations peoples, and junior people in the workplace.
AN
One assumes that the CoS waited for a decent interval of time for Bwana to act. Failing that he has outed them. Hanson followed up by reading the commentary into Hansard.
Bwana is left with two options: Silence or…
Rakali
You might want to go to QT and see Shorten’s answer to a Dixer on the RC.
It absolutely flattened those opposite.
“ who themselves obviously, with their friendships with people of colour, are not racist per se”
Yeah, just like Calvin Candie wasn’t a racist because he shared a whiskey with his man about the house, Stephen:
https://youtu.be/8YAscXQKLSs
Thanks Boerwar
As in..
…some of my best friends are racists.
Did anyone happen to see the Angus Taylor rant after the completion of Question Time today ?
The reply from and by Dr Andrew Leigh set the tone for establishment of the crime commission.
Taylor is on borrowed time which perhaps explains the interest payments to the Cayman Islands !
The Natural Order of the Universe is that the Greens get on their high moral horses and smite evil every where they see it. Which is everywhere. Just look at Hanson. They were almost drooling over Hanson. Who obliged. Lovely culture war battle!
No-one is ever good enough for the Greens.
No policy is ever good enough for Greens.
In Greens World the perfect is the enemy of good people and good policies.
Everyone who is not with them is against them.
Everyone who is against them is the same old same old.
But, confronted with some fairly hideous behaviour by one of their senators, they appear to be utterly incapable of responding.
The YouGov poll as mentioned earlier had erroneous figures for the + – from the previous survey, there has been a 9-point swing in 2 to 3 days. The Preferred PM metric also moved 9 points to put Starmer ahead of Truss
Election Maps UK
@ElectionMapsUK
Westminster Voting Intention:
LAB: 45% (+5)
CON: 28% (-4)
LDM: 9% (=)
GRN: 7% (-1)
SNP: 4% (-1)
RFM: 3% (=)
Via @YouGov
23-25 Sep.
Changes w/ 21-22 Sep
Goll
I watched the first couple of sentences and it was deja vu all over again: trite, tawdry, banal…
C@t:
A person can be deeply racist while still maintaining friendships and relationships with members of the races they are prejudiced towards. The two things aren’t mutually exclusive.
Trump is a very racist man. There are mountains of evidence to that effect. To suggest that he is not, on account of him being friends (insofar as a narcissist like Trump is capable of being friends with anyone) with some African Americans is, well, really quite silly.
A swing to the left in Oz and the UK and a swing to the right just about everywhere else in the democratic world?
Ray (UK) says:
Tuesday, September 27, 2022 at 6:04 pm
The YouGov poll as mentioned earlier had erroneous figures for the + – from the previous survey, there has been a 9-point swing in 2 to 3 days. The Preferred PM metric also moved 9 points to put Starmer ahead of Truss
中华人民共和国
I read some Tories are already considering lodging Letters of No Confidence to the 1922 Committee.
Annastacia Palaszczuk
@AnnastaciaMP
If you’re impacted by the Optus data breach,
@TMRQld
will issue you a replacement driver licence with a new licence number free of charge.
6:00 PM · Sep 27, 2022
·Twitter for iPhone
Andrew_Earlwood @ #151 Tuesday, September 27th, 2022 – 5:57 pm
No, it’s nothing like it at all.
You’re embarrassing yourself now, Andrew_Earlwood. Scroungbing around for something, anything, to support your failed argument. Sad.
Boerwar at 6:07 pm
I would not call the UK and Aus as swinging to the left. It is more a rejection of Bullshit Man and the BoJo/Truss circus , appaling leaders in charge of ‘been there too long’ governments.
Boerwar, have you ever considered that treating every single thing a Greens MP ever does or says as the worst thing any politician has ever done might actually undermine efforts to draw attention to the areas where the Greens can legitimately be criticized. It’s the Boy-Who-Cried-Wolf effect.
(For what it’s worth, I do think Bandt has erred in not pulling up Thorpe on her rhetoric.)
You really think you’re winning this one, don’t you C@t.
Asha @ #158 Tuesday, September 27th, 2022 – 6:06 pm
Well I just think that’s splitting hairs for the sake of continuing to reinforce your pov.
I’m well aware of his behaviour towards the Central Park 3 and President Obama, for just 2 examples. But it’s all simply been political marketing for him at the end of the day because he has formed close genuine, friendships with People of Colour. Sure, he casts them off once they are no longer 100% supportive of him, like a true narcissist, but that ignores that he wasn’t averse to making them a friend in the first instance. As a true racist would be.
p
um…
I agree with the general view that governments get themselves out of government rather than oppositions winning government.
But there does seem to be some significant swinging to the right in lots of democracies.
In Australia the last election may well have created an impression of a significant swing to the left when the primary vote for the right and the far right parties was still a healthy 46% and when only 12% of voters voted for a party that wanted to put up taxes to the high levels which would might have delivered some systemic hard left changes to Australia.
Andrew_Earlwood @ #165 Tuesday, September 27th, 2022 – 6:15 pm
You can take your patronising comments and shove them, Andrew_Earlwood.
‘Asha says:
Tuesday, September 27, 2022 at 6:13 pm
Boerwar, have you ever considered that treating every single thing a Greens MP ever does or says as the worst thing any politician has ever done might actually undermine efforts to draw attention to the areas where the Greens can legitimately be criticized. It’s the Boy-Who-Cried-Wolf effect.
(For what it’s worth, I do think Bandt has erred in not pulling up Thorpe on her rhetoric.)’
================================================================
Let’s see what we have here. Bwana has ‘erred’. Why is that? How is that? Do you really want to label Thorpe’s behaviour as ‘rhetoric’?
LR
A good initiative by Queensland. Not sure what is happening in other states. Not possible in the ACT.
Hitler had Jewish friends in his youth.
So, clearly not a racist. …
https://www.nytimes.com/1933/08/22/archives/hitler-condemned-pogroms-as-young-man-had-jewish-friends-companion.html
Why is it that when people can’t prosecute an argument with an appreciation of, and reply with, nuance, they resort to juvenile attempts to humiliate?
Plus, they simply ignore the relevant parts of comments where the person they are attacking agrees with their basic premise.
I guess, at the end of the day, their time here is for getting off on their obvious attempts to strut and preen.
C@t. I thought it would help ease things off if I agreed to stop highlighting and commenting about your defence of Hanson and commentary about racism. But you go on. And dig ever deeper.
Why don’t you do the same now and just ease off a little bit. I think it would help.
BW
Tuesday, September 27, 2022 at 6:04 pm
Goll
I watched the first couple of sentences and it was deja vu all over again: trite, tawdry, banal…
Taylor was and is ……..
Leigh on the other hand was directed and specific.
Taylor will be a major casualty of the to be established commission.
I quite honestly doubt Donald Trump has ever had a “close, genuine friendship” with anybody. I’d be surprised if he can even comprehend what friendship is. His relationships are purely transactional.
Someone can be friendly and cordial to a person while still holding racist views about them. They can count them among their friends while still thinking of them as a “lesser person”, or perhaps “one of the good ones.” Most racists aren’t attending lynchings or screaming racial epithets at every person of colour that they encounter. Prejudice is much more subtle and complex than that.
Andrew_Earlwood @ #171 Tuesday, September 27th, 2022 – 6:22 pm
Oh dear. Godwin’s Law. Is that the best you’ve got left? 😆
Did the Greens Senators vote for the Coalition/Labor amendments to their censure motion?
Are European fascist racists?
Goll
I did not listen to Leigh’s reply. Glad to hear that he did well.
Asha says:
Tuesday, September 27, 2022 at 6:24 pm
I don’t think reasoned comments get through to some posters who have their ‘views’.
”
Ashasays:
Tuesday, September 27, 2022 at 6:24 pm
I quite honestly doubt Donald Trump has ever had a “close, genuine friendship” with anybody. I’d be surprised if he can even comprehend what friendship is. His relationships are purely transactional.
Someone can be friendly and cordial to a person while still holding racist views about them. They can count them among their friends while still thinking of them as a “lesser person”, or perhaps “one of the good ones.” Most racists aren’t attending lynchings or screaming racial epithets at every person of colour that they encounter. Prejudice is much more subtle and complex than that.
”
Is Trump speech on Mexicans to announce his candidacy for POTUS racist?
https://time.com/3923128/donald-trump-announcement-speech/
Boerwar
Unfortunately nobody is asking why. It seems easier just to say they are all a bunch of ‘deplorables’ or some such term than ask why such parties are suddenly finding their views appealing.
And now for something completely different …
Coal Junkies.
“ Most racists aren’t attending lynchings or screaming racial epithets at every person of colour that they encounter. Prejudice is much more subtle and complex than that.”
Yet Pauline is apparently off the hook as being a racist because she hasn’t actually firebombed a Chinese restaurant.
And while we are at it: why is firebombing a Chinese restaurant – or at least the desire to – a measure of being racist? Who amongst us hasn’t wanted to fire bomb a Chinese restaurant at least once? I mean, I still can’t even drive past the Happy Dragon in Carlingford without feeling an overwhelming urge to lob in a Molotov 30 years after hugging the porcelain for a weekend after a Friday evening buffet experience to never forget. …
Ven:
Yes.
It must be the change in shift on bludger. P1 has clocked in.
‘The peer who organised the Queen’s funeral has been banned from driving for six months, despite claiming he needed his licence to arrange the King’s upcoming coronation .. Edward Fitzalan-Howard, the 18th Duke of Norfolk, was caught using his mobile phone while driving in Battersea, south-west London, on 7 April’
(BBC)